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The Throwdown ended in a tie, 10 to 10
"Beer Bad," not "Where the Wild Things Are," is Buffy's worst episode.
Melissalane said
Don't get me wrong. Both are bad--by Buffy standards, which also means that both are more enjoyable than some TV shows' best stuff. (Perhaps that could be another throwdown--are the greatest, say, Full House episodes worse than Buffy's lowest moments? Uncle Jesse's wedding to Becky was a great moment by that show's standards--and it had Jesse arrested and jailed for skydiving into prized tomatoes. I digress.)
While talking Buffy earlier with Allimuffin, we found we disagree on the worst episode. I believe "Beer Bad" fits the bill for more reasons than just these--but it's a start!
1. Stupid Veruca, signaling that our beloved Oz will not be with us much longer;
2. Pretentious frat boys that Buffy would never go for--except she does! "Beer Bad" must be a parallel universe of some sort. Oh, well, maybe they'll turn into cavemen;
3. Freaking CAVEMEN!;
4. Parker, who is like a caveman, what with his innocent, "Oh, sleeping with a woman somehow leads her on? I thought it was simply two souls connecting for a brief moment." Puke. Any episode with him gets points deducted in my book.
5. Mopey Buffy. She's no fun in the episodes where she hates life because Lame Parker left.
Allimuffin said
While I agree that "Beer Bad" is one of Buffy's lower moments, "Where the Wild Things Are" is the more unpleasant viewing experience. Buffy and Riley do the nasty throughout the episode in a possessed frat house with orgasm-inducing walls (it seems that the presence of frat boys on Buffy indicate a crappy episode). The whole concept is just kind of lame and watching all the Buffy/Riley sex is just icky.
If I had to pick my poison, I'd rather watch a mopey turned neanderthal-Buffy than ****-Buffy/Riley sweaty boinking.
Melissalane said
What makes me think that "Where the Wild Things Are" simply can't be the worst episode is that, gross Buffy-Riley plot aside, it has some really fantastic little moments going for it. For example, Anya and Spike bond for the first time ever, about their lost powers and how they should just kill off Xander and Dru. Those two together cracked me up like no other pairing.
If that isn't enough for you, this is the episode where we see Giles sing for the first time! This is his big pre-musical Buffy debut. His voice in this episode (and in "Restless") is a big part of what made me so psyched for "Once More, with Feeling." Also, his "Behind Blue Eyes" got Anya and even Tara and Willow a little flushed. I'm not going to lie to you, Allimuffin--it got me a bit flushed, too.
On the other hand, what little gems does "Beer Bad" serve up? Besides Buffy sporting some pretty kinky "Cavegirl" hair, I can't think of a one.
Allimuffin said
Oooo, you have some very good points there: Giles singing in the coffee house was GREAT and seeing Anya and Spike reminiscing about their good ol' days is a heck of a lot of fun. Still...all that sex with Riley that gave Buffy little to do all episode except roll around and say terrible lines like, "I need you touching me." or something cringe-y like that.
Buffy had kinky hair in this episode too--but I don't mean THAT kind of 'kinky'...
Melissalane said
Yeah, Buffy has some pretty terrible lines--and hair, you're right!--in "Where the Wild Things Are." Lots of moaning with Riley, and it's all very gross.
But as far as terrible Buffy lines go, it's tough to top these, all courtesy of Cavegirl Buffy in "Beer Bad":
--"I'm suffering the afterness of a bad night of... badness."
--"TV is a good thing. Bright colors. Music. Tiny little people."
--"Want beer. Like beer. Beer good."
--"Lots and lots of beer. It's nice. Foamy... comforting. It's... beer."
--"Boy smell nice."
The commenters are listing some pretty good (and by good I mean bad) episodes. The reason "Beer Bad" is my least favorite instead of any high school episodes, later-season episodes, or even "WtWTA," is this: The wonderful group dynamic that usually made the silliest storylines bearable simply wasn't there. Not only were Cordelia and Angel long gone, this episode doesn't have Anya or Spike in it to make up for that. Oz is there, but Veruca's presence lets us know he won't be for long. Tara won't show up for a few more episodes. This sily storyline didn't have the same Scooby humor and punch that other ones did to balance it out.
Allimuffin said
After asking around the office for help in making my case that "Where the Wild Things Are" is the lamest of Buffy episodes, the genral opinion was "ugh, that episode was stupid", and then when I asked them to compare it to "Beer Bad" their response was, "I loved 'Beer Bad'!"
I'm sort of out of logic arguments at this point, so my argument is mainly a gut one. While 'Beer Bad' may not be the cleverest or most memorable, at least it doesn't leave a bad aftertaste.
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Comments
loglady 04/04/08
how can we possibly overlook inca mummy girl?
Melissalane 04/05/08
I think Bad Season 4 is much worse than Bad Season 2, personally. Plus, I have a soft spot for "Inca Mummy Girl" because it's Oz's first episode.
hmorsey 04/05/08
I know I'm in the minority...but Restless is my least fav ep...it made me stop watching the show when it aired...i didnt rediscover the show til years later...and i dont really mind beer bad or where the wild things are all that much
loglady 04/05/08
or that hyena episode (is it just called hyena???) god, the bad special effects in that one...heck that whole season....
loglady 04/05/08
sorry for double post, but wanted to clarify i meant that whole season had bad special effects, not that the whole season was bad....
scarsandstories8 04/05/08
i'm with restless... i just didn't think that episode was as amazing as other people did. in fact, i thought quite the opposite. it honestly reminds me of when a terrible movie wins best picture.
bluetenille 04/05/08
I'm for beer bad. The only thing I enjoyed from it was buffy's "beer bad, tree pretty". I enjoy all the Scooby moments in where the wild things are.
LisaD 04/05/08
The thing about the 4th season is that it spawned one of the greatest buffy episodes ever "Hush" , my favorite /part of the buffy beer bad is when she conks Parker on the head with the mallot.
Moononastring 04/05/08
Both the two worst episodes of Buffy. Both are icky and distrubing for different reasons. However, I still have to give the edge to Beer Bad as the worse episode. At least Wild Things had some sort of supernatural story that kind-a-sorta made sense. Evil beer? Who came up with THAT idea? Plus, the whole thing kind of felt like an after school special.
ellie 04/06/08
I didn't like any episode with Veruca in it. She was the worst. I'd have to go with Beer Bad. But I agree with hmorsey. I really did not like Restless. If I remember correctly, when I bought that season on DVD, there was that note in it that Joss Whedon wrote about the letter box format, and at the end, he apologized for an episode. I totally thought he was referring to Restless.
ellie 04/06/08
I didn't like any episode with Veruca in it. She was the worst. I'd have to go with Beer Bad. But I agree with hmorsey. I really did not like Restless. If I remember correctly, when I bought that season on DVD, there was that note in it that Joss Whedon wrote about the letter box format, and at the end, he apologized for an episode. I totally thought he was referring to Restless.
Justin 04/06/08
I have never minded "Where the Wild Things Are," but will agree that Beer Bad is that absolute worst episode.
loglady 04/07/08
so for the sake of making an informed opinion, i've gone back and watched both episodes (okay, i actually watched like 20 eps this weekend, it was raining) and now i feel as though i can make my decision...
there is one tiny thing that makes 'beer bad' the lesser of two evils for me and it can be stated in two words:
kal penn
dunno why, but i love the guy...
Melissalane 04/07/08
I love that you did that, loglady. That's what I call fun research.
Moononastring 04/07/08
Haha, fun research! Good excuse to go watch Buffy =)
The Kal Penn thing actually pushes the episode in the other direction for me only because Kal Penn showed up on Angel a season or two later in a different, completely unrelated role. Yes this was before that ever happened, and it has nothing to do with the quality of the episode (or lack thereof) per se, but it just gets me that much more annoyed with the episode.
I agree that the Veruca stuff was pretty irritating -- though it did give Allyson Hannigan some great moments. She was really fantastic.
Melissalane 04/09/08
Why has this throwdown stalled? I posted my last argument days ago.
OzzieAlThor 04/09/08
Not everyone can get on EVERY day. :)
babblingbrooke 04/09/08
'Where the Wild Things Are' isn't the best episode, but I have never been irritated by it the way I have with 'Beer Bad.' I've always thought season four to be the weakest of the seven seasons as it is, it has few truly stellar episodes which is rare for a season of Buffy. The best that come to my mind are Hush (of course) and Living Conditions.
Melissalane 04/09/08
Oh, I didn't mean to sound as if I was criticizing my opponent! I just meant that in the past, when I haven't posted an argument within a day, my turn has been forfeited. Since I posted, like, four days ago, I'm wondering if there's something wrong with the throwdown. For all I know, my opponent has tried to post and it wouldn't let her. It just seems as though there's some sort of technical problem.
And, of course, I am completely addicted, so I do come on here every day. Is there a support group?
Candy Cavity 04/10/08
"Beer good" is one of my favorite quotes from "Buffy"! It serves many purposes depending on the situation, and sounds very elemental. The Buffy-Riley sex episode does make me want to vomit. I"m with the poor girl without an argument. Maybe someone can step in and substitute for her.
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